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  #1  
Old 07-25-2009, 09:57 PM
argnob argnob is offline
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Posts: 17
Default PPL 2 - problems, including where's the output window?

I'm finding the learning curve steep, trying to get to grips with PPL 2 and, at the moment, am unsure if I'm wasting time trying because, perhaps, a lot doesn't work properly yet.

I haven't worked with anything involving producing code by dragging and dropping before.

I looked in vain for example programs to run - PPL 1 had plenty of examples - which would have hopefully reassured me that PPL 2 is properly installed and behaving itself reasonably well.

Both in my own attempts to write something extremely simple to try to establish PPL 2 is working and in my attempts to follow the instructions in the End User Manual for a very simple game, involving a bomb graphic following the cursor around, I get the situation that I run a program but see no output. The green forward arrow of the run button turns black, indicating it has been clicked, but I can't see any program output anywhere - not by selecting a different Window from the menu, not by minimising the PIDE.

The End User Manual was a surprise, as I had expected something full of items on built-in functions and their syntax. Perhaps the Help file and the code completion feature render that kind of manual unnecessary. The code completion feature does ease my frustration at not being able to select code snippets from the Help file to copy and paste.

Can anyone reassure me that they are getting at least some simple programs to work in PPL 2 in its current state? I have the complete package and all my files are fully up-to-date. Thus far I haven't got even as far as a successful Hello world program.

Trying to reproduce the bomb follows cursor game from the End User Manual, I had a crash regularly at the same point (when I was trying to change the parameters of the Move method to X$ and Y$ as described on p39 of the manual). I think there is a lower case x$ and y$ to be had from the list but I don't think I've managed to get them to show up in the Move method with the $ signs.

The issue with the crashes might have been that I had a CD playing in Media player and maybe the game was fighting for control over the sound? Maybe not though. After all, I hadn't yet got to the stage of running the program.

I was unable to complete the process of sending a crash report because the system locked up as soon as I hit the send button in Outlook. Not so locked that the Caps Lock key ceased functioning but so locked up that everything was unresponsive, so I had to reboot.

On attempting to run the bomb follows cursor project - having chosen not to run Media player at the same time - I avoided a crash but just got the blacked out run button and no visible window showing execution of the program.

A few other queries:

Hidden under the PIDE window there's a little PIDE Helper window which just has a title bar and no visible content in the window Does that sound right?

Is it possible to do a reinstall/repair install without redownloading everything? (Pointless to waste the bandwidth if the files haven't been updated.)

Is it possible to get the program installed on a Windows Mobile device without reinstalling on the PC? When I first installed, the program said it would install to the Mobile device when it was next connected but this didn't happen. I did get it on to the Mobile device by reinstalling on the PC with the Mobile Device connected by ActiveSync. However, I got a screenful of errors when I tried to run PPL 2 on the Mobile device. I wondered if that might be because a version of PPL 1.xx was already on the Mobile device, so I've now taken PPL completely off the Mobile device but haven't yet had another go at getting it over on to the Mobile device again to see works now.

I note from another posting that maybe PPL 2 doesn't yet work with Windows Mobile - or at least some people are having connection problems - so perhaps I'd be wasting.my time at the moment to persevere with getting it installed on Windows Mobile?

My main reason for getting PPL is to be able to produce programs to run on Windows Mobile. I have more familiar alternatives for programming on the PC.

Incidentally, I'd forgotten my login for the PPL forum so tried registering afresh. The new registration process repeatedly ended with an error saying I hadn't filled in a required field. This was not true. I suspect that what it didn't like was reuse of an e-mail address that was already on its database. I finally got it to accept me by using a different one.
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  #2  
Old 07-26-2009, 02:55 AM
kornalius kornalius is offline
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Join Date: Apr 2006
Posts: 551
Default

We are working on a Tutorial manual which should be released in about 1 month. This should help you.

You are absolutely right PPL 2 does not have examples, something we will remedy soon.

I can assure you that running a game or anything PPL1 or a form's based application works very well in PPL 2. I don't know what is wrong on your side.

The crash reporter is a tool we are using called EurekaLog and we have no control on its functioning. We have received reports with it but it does not seem to be as stable as the company told us it was.

The PIDE Helper is a window that serves for the visual form builder. How big is your screen? That window should be positionned at coordinates 4096,4096.

You can re-install anything you want at any time. Just go to My Documents\PPL Documents\ you should see the setup files for all products you've downloaded so far.

If you've installed the Windows Mobile SDK on top of your old PPL 1 installation it won't work for sure. PPL 2 has many upgrades in the language syntax that will cause tons of errors when trying to launch the old PPL IDE on Windows Mobile device.

Wait until we issue the next update to work on Windows Mobile (should be early next week). We are reworking the whole thing to make it smoother and better.


Best Regards,
Alain Deschenes
http://www.arianesoft.ca



Quote:
Originally Posted by argnob View Post
I'm finding the learning curve steep, trying to get to grips with PPL 2 and, at the moment, am unsure if I'm wasting time trying because, perhaps, a lot doesn't work properly yet.

I haven't worked with anything involving producing code by dragging and dropping before.

I looked in vain for example programs to run - PPL 1 had plenty of examples - which would have hopefully reassured me that PPL 2 is properly installed and behaving itself reasonably well.

Both in my own attempts to write something extremely simple to try to establish PPL 2 is working and in my attempts to follow the instructions in the End User Manual for a very simple game, involving a bomb graphic following the cursor around, I get the situation that I run a program but see no output. The green forward arrow of the run button turns black, indicating it has been clicked, but I can't see any program output anywhere - not by selecting a different Window from the menu, not by minimising the PIDE.

The End User Manual was a surprise, as I had expected something full of items on built-in functions and their syntax. Perhaps the Help file and the code completion feature render that kind of manual unnecessary. The code completion feature does ease my frustration at not being able to select code snippets from the Help file to copy and paste.

Can anyone reassure me that they are getting at least some simple programs to work in PPL 2 in its current state? I have the complete package and all my files are fully up-to-date. Thus far I haven't got even as far as a successful Hello world program.

Trying to reproduce the bomb follows cursor game from the End User Manual, I had a crash regularly at the same point (when I was trying to change the parameters of the Move method to X$ and Y$ as described on p39 of the manual). I think there is a lower case x$ and y$ to be had from the list but I don't think I've managed to get them to show up in the Move method with the $ signs.

The issue with the crashes might have been that I had a CD playing in Media player and maybe the game was fighting for control over the sound? Maybe not though. After all, I hadn't yet got to the stage of running the program.

I was unable to complete the process of sending a crash report because the system locked up as soon as I hit the send button in Outlook. Not so locked that the Caps Lock key ceased functioning but so locked up that everything was unresponsive, so I had to reboot.

On attempting to run the bomb follows cursor project - having chosen not to run Media player at the same time - I avoided a crash but just got the blacked out run button and no visible window showing execution of the program.

A few other queries:

Hidden under the PIDE window there's a little PIDE Helper window which just has a title bar and no visible content in the window Does that sound right?

Is it possible to do a reinstall/repair install without redownloading everything? (Pointless to waste the bandwidth if the files haven't been updated.)

Is it possible to get the program installed on a Windows Mobile device without reinstalling on the PC? When I first installed, the program said it would install to the Mobile device when it was next connected but this didn't happen. I did get it on to the Mobile device by reinstalling on the PC with the Mobile Device connected by ActiveSync. However, I got a screenful of errors when I tried to run PPL 2 on the Mobile device. I wondered if that might be because a version of PPL 1.xx was already on the Mobile device, so I've now taken PPL completely off the Mobile device but haven't yet had another go at getting it over on to the Mobile device again to see works now.

I note from another posting that maybe PPL 2 doesn't yet work with Windows Mobile - or at least some people are having connection problems - so perhaps I'd be wasting.my time at the moment to persevere with getting it installed on Windows Mobile?

My main reason for getting PPL is to be able to produce programs to run on Windows Mobile. I have more familiar alternatives for programming on the PC.

Incidentally, I'd forgotten my login for the PPL forum so tried registering afresh. The new registration process repeatedly ended with an error saying I hadn't filled in a required field. This was not true. I suspect that what it didn't like was reuse of an e-mail address that was already on its database. I finally got it to accept me by using a different one.
__________________
Regards,
Alain Deschenes
ArianeSoft Inc.
http://www.arianesoft.ca
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  #3  
Old 07-26-2009, 09:14 PM
argnob argnob is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 17
Default PPL 2 problems - no execution window, path to runtime

Thanks for the info in your response.

You raised how big my screen is. Its 1680x1050 resolution. However, I now realise the empty PIDE Helper window in the middle of the screen, usually hidden underneath the main PPL application window, is not a cause for doubt that things are as they should be. Such PIDE Helper window is also present in PPL 1.xx.

I have not yet resolved getting no window showing program execution when running PPL 2 on my XP Pro desktop. Historically that has been a two screen system - which used to mean new windows would sometimes open on the second screen, unseen if the second screen was not turned on. The second screen failed and I haven't replaced it. However, I'm convinced the system is currently set up for a single screen. I've confirmed that PPL 1 runs OK, showing a program execution window on the now single-screen XP Pro system.

I uninstalled and reinstalled on my Vista Ultimate 64 desktop but was not surprised to find it didn't work there: 1) it's Vista and 2) it's 64 bit. (Installed OK (with at least one of the setup files having to be run as administrator) but crashed on trying to execute a program. I haven't spotted whether PPL 2 is supposed to be usable on 64 bit systems. Some 32 bit software is happy to run on a 64 bit system but I don't think all 32 bit software will.

I uninstalled and reinstalled on my XP Home laptop. Just trying to eliminate the possibility that there is some residual two screen/extended desktop setting on the XP Pro desktop that I'm managing to overlook. The problem on the laptop is now that I can't run anything in PPL 2 because the PC runtime can't be found. The program was looking for a runtime in a non-existent directory on the C: drive: c:\ppl\. I tried to get at the runtime path to edit it via Tools, Preferences, Properties but was unable to bring up a box enabling me to edit the path and have now thoroughly garbled the path string by changing it to an expression. The path details persist through uninstallation and reinstallation. Please can you advise how I get at the path details to fix them? Do I have to go through a properties box or is there a text file somewhere I can edit?

I note your assurance that "running a game or anything PPL1 or a form's based application works very well in PPL 2" and can't really imagine that you would release a product before it was usable, especially given you have had the assistance of beta testers.
I have always found your product support very good.
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  #4  
Old 07-26-2009, 10:21 PM
argnob argnob is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 17
Default Setting path to executable

Further to my earlier reply, I see I was wrong to say that I don't have a C:\PPL folder but that's probably irrelevant. The folder that contains the executable ppl.exe is, on my system, C:\Documents and Settings\Graham\My Documents\PPL2\Runtime\. When I try to run a project PPL 2 is looking for PPL.exe in the PPL2 folder and not the Runtime folder below it and reporting "Unable to execute "C:\Documents and Settings\Graham\My Documents\PPL2\PPL.exe".

I've now managed to alter some paths in Tools, Preferences, Properties by pointing and clicking (whereas I had expected to be able to type into a box) but there are still entries which look wrong that I can't manage to change.

I assume there is a file somewhere I could delete to get rid of the wrong information which is persisting through uninstallation and reinstallation but haven't identified it.
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  #5  
Old 07-26-2009, 11:43 PM
Kobus Kobus is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Spain
Posts: 141
Default

Hello,

Are you THE A. Graham??
Anyway, pleasy stay in touch - you are of great value to this community.
I have sent some mails to Alain the last few days and be sure that he will work on all issues.

Greetz,
Helen.
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  #6  
Old 07-27-2009, 09:41 AM
argnob argnob is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 17
Default Mistaken identity

Sorry, not THE A. Graham.
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  #7  
Old 07-27-2009, 02:36 PM
kornalius kornalius is offline
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You can delete the prefs.xml file in the My Documents\PPL2 folder. What I cannot understand is that you are not able to edit the preferences properties from the property editor, this is weird.
__________________
Regards,
Alain Deschenes
ArianeSoft Inc.
http://www.arianesoft.ca
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  #8  
Old 07-27-2009, 04:11 PM
argnob argnob is offline
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Default

OK. I deleted the prefs.xml file in the My Documents\PPL2 folder. I closed down PPL 2 and restarted it. On trying to run a project, PPL 2 still tried to execute PPL.exe from the PPL2 directory - above the Runtime directory where PPL.exe is actually located.

I ran the uninstallation program which comes as part of PPL 2 and then reinstalled. Despite the deletion of prefs.xml, on running PPL 2, I did not get the window saying I appear to be running PPL 2 for the first time - these are the current directory settings for runtimes etc.

On trying to run a project, PPL 2 now wants to execute PPL.exe from a subdirectory of C:\PPL:
Unable to execute "c:\ppl\pc\run\PPL.exe (#3)

I don't know how I got confused last night but C:\PPL really does not exist on the laptop that I'm currently trying to run PPL 2 on.

I don't know where PPL 2 gets the idea from that c:\ppl does exist (assuming this is not a folder that it is supposed to create itself). The laptop did once have PPL 1.xx on it but I've removed it. I wonder if there might be some registry entries left behind from the PPL 1 installation that PPL 2 is finding?

I have now managed to edit paths using the keyboard instead of by pointing and clicking. The paths are edited in situ rather than, as I expected, in a dialog box.

I have used Tools, Preferences, Properties, to change
Platform, Intel_Folder
to
C:\Documents and Settings\Graham\MyDocuments\PPL2
and
Run, Intel_WorkFolder
to
C:\Documents and Settings\Graham\MyDocuments\PPL2\Runtime
but PPL 2 persists in trying to run PPL.exe from
C:\Documents and Settings\Graham\MyDocuments\PPL2
when it needs to look in
C:\Documents and Settings\Graham\MyDocuments\PPL2\Runtime.

Is there some other Property that I'm overlooking that I need to change in order to make PPL 2 look in the Runtime directory for PPL.exe?

Is there something else I need to delete, besides prefs.xml, to be able to start again from scratch with the PPL 2 install?

Incidentally, I tried copying the .exe files from the Runtime folder to the PPL2 folder to see if that would make the program happy but then it wanted a .dll file. So I copied over all the files in the Runtime folder to PPL2 but still no joy: error message: Could not connect to server. Obviously copying the files is not the right approach to solving the problem but I just wondered if it was sufficient for the time being. It's not.

I don't understand the (#3) or (#2) I variously get appended to messages about being unable to run PPL.exe. I probably don't need to understand them but I just mention them in case it throws any light on what is happening.
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  #9  
Old 07-27-2009, 05:20 PM
Kobus Kobus is offline
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Join Date: Feb 2009
Location: Spain
Posts: 141
Default

Hi,

Have you also checked this in your project:
In the Project Manager window, select the "Project" line and then you also see the Platform and Run settings in the Properties window.

Greetzz,
Helen.
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  #10  
Old 07-27-2009, 05:23 PM
argnob argnob is offline
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Join Date: Jul 2009
Posts: 17
Default Finally got PPL 2 to run a project

Not the ideal solution but copied the contents of the PPL2 Runtime folder from where it is installed (under My Documents) to where PPL2 (as freshly installed) looks for PPL.exe (when running a project for the PC) (in c:\ppl\pc\run).

My previously documented attempts to tell PPL 2 to look in the Runtime subfolder under My Documents failed to make it possible to run PPL.exe. Thus this workaround for now.

This has at least shown that PPL 2 can display the elusive (for me) program execution window, which I was not getting on the XP Pro Desktop where I initially installed PPL 2 - and that there is now hope of me actually being able to do something with PPL 2 (ahead of proper fixes in due course).

Incidentally, on the XP Pro Desktop, although the green run button went black and stayed black when I attempted to run a program (and when I exited I was asked if I wanted to halt the debugger), I did not get the messages about available memory, root folder etc. which I now get displayed when I successfully run a project on the laptop. Thus I think PPL 2 was not functioning properly on the Desktop PC and think I can probably discard the possibility that had occurred to me that the Desktop PC has still some remnant of being set up as a dual screen system and that PPL 2 was trying to display the execution window on a screen that I no longer have.
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